Newbie/General ForumBeginner/basic questions and general EVO discussion. Specific questions should be asked in a focused forum below. This area is for the newbies.
The first time that I changed my spark plugs they were black and looked like every other normal used spark plug I have seen; however, my car recently started misfiring and generally had no power. So I pulled the plugs and they were orange in color, so I changed them. The car runs fine now, but I am just wondering why they got like that and why so fast(less than a year)
The only thing I can find is on a spark plug chart it says that they can look like that because the engine is running hot...but here are some pictures(not the best)
List Of Mods:
-Megan Racing 3" Turbo Back Exhaust
-Megan Racing O2 Housing
-Hallman Pro Manual Boost Controller @ 21psi
-Brian Crower Stage 2 (272) Cams
-Walbro 255lph Fuel Pump
-K&N Drop In Filter
-JDM BOV
-Dynoflash eTune
When I swapped the plugs I did not have it tuned, I do not.
When I use the "Aktive Matrix" Mitsubishi logger it at times says I have as much as 140~ counts of knock. I suppose I could be reading it wrong or something, but that seems kind of high....
But as of now it is fully tuned, and with a brand new set of BPR7ES spark plugs
I just put the new plugs in (BPR7ES) and after driving for about 20 minutes or so I took them out to check them. And they are white....not really white, but lightly white. I would imagine that if I continue to drive they will only get worse.
I just got tuned, and am able to get a revision. Don't know if that is it or not...
Could my fuel injectors be the thing to blame? Bad fuel injectors in combination with a lean tune could do it couldn't it?
It will be a while before I am tuned again, I read and what I read it seemed like Dynoflash was the place to go. Just out of curiosity why don't you like them/him?
I use this as a guideline; Diagnosing Spark Plug Health
To me it looks like it's a little on the hot side. Maybe try BPR8ES.
The plugs in the original post; Were they BPR7ES' too? If so, how long were they in for? I'm asking because copper have to be changed more often then the irridiums (every5K to 6K miles).
Can you post a log too?
IMO DYNO Flash is bad for one main reason every car is different. and Two is that they use the same tune for everyone. that means they send me the same flash as you and they think it is ok....ummm I do not think so.
Just my $0.02
____________________________
SCOTT
EVO VIII SSL
313AWH 313TRQ
IMO DYNO Flash is bad for one main reason every car is different. and Two is that they use the same tune for everyone. that means they send me the same flash as you and they think it is ok....ummm I do not think so.
Just my $0.02
Remind me to buy you a beer next time we hang out...
Cheers-
E
____________________________
Warr's personal competitor
I had two sets of BPR7ES plugs the first set were gapped at around .030, and the second set were gapped to about .026.
The set that was gapped to about .026 were the ones that turned white.
The others were in the car before it was tuned and turned orange prior to the car being tuned, but I got the car tuned and put those plugs back in and they are not turning white.
So I am wondering if I just get a set of BPR7ES plugs and gap them to about .030 if that would be alright?
Or should BPR8ES plugs be tried?
Also, what is the difference between BPR8ES and BR8ES plugs?
Another thing is about how long do the fuel injectors last on these cars? A lot people will tell you that fuel injectors should usually be changed every 100k miles or so.
With your mods there is no reason you need to run 8's. The BPR7's will work just fine and should be gapped from about .24 to .28. I'd try the higher end of that and see how it comes out. If you plan to run race gas and higher boost levels or meth then I'd look at some 8's. It's odd that they'd change so drastically if you're not detonating.
It's hard to tell from the pics but if the color is more grey than white you should be ok. Also do a compression check to make sure you're not getting any false readings.
Last ditch effort I'd take some really good close up shots and e-mail them to Martin Musial at AMS and ask his opinion. He's pretty old school and can read plugs well.
Alright, so I got new plugs and gapped them differently...still doing it(turning white)
I have taken the car almost apart and have checked everything(even if it didn't relate to what is going on)
all intake piping, exhaust manifold, intake manifold, timing/timing belt, pulled valve cover checked everything under there, checked compression still at 180psi in all four cylinders
my air filter had a bit of sand in it which I have no idea why, but it is a k&n drop-in so I am cleaning that now, I don't see how that could be the issue but I am doing it anyway...
i got the car tuned last sunday and it ran AMAZING for like 4 days or so, then just one day it just stopped and so I changed the plugs as they were orange and then they started to turn white....
so I am running out of ideas, I am just wondering if it has anything to do with either the fuel pump or the fuel injectors (say if they are not running quite up to par that could cause it to run super lean causing it to do what it is doing)
I could try BPR8ES plugs but as someone said earlier with my mods I should not have to, and if I shouldn't have to then something it wrong, and I want to figure out what it is!
the car has ~80,000 miles on it, so it is POSSIBLE that the internals of the fuel injectors are worn, they tick rather loud too, louder than what seems normal...
I suppose I could have it retuned, but if it was running GREAT for a few days then it doesn't seem like that is the issue, but then again it could be...
but anyway, sorry for the long post, but any suggestions or ideas would be greatly appreciated!
I will also try to post a log, maybe that will help...
well just for giggle i tried the BR8ES plugs and well, it still does it....
i am just wondering if it really is indeed the fuel injectors? prior to this happening it would struggle a little while boost was at 10-15 psi, and then would just kick in, and sometime it wouldn't do that
based on all of the information that i can find these are hot plugs, all of the symptoms that i have are from plugs and cylinders getting too hot, but then i tried a cooler plug and it still does it...so i have no idea
i could try to flash the ecu back to how it was and see what happens then
here are pics of the BPR7ES plugs that were in it, the BR8ES plugs look the same
What injectors are you running? Have someone with Evoscan knowledge look at your fuel trims at idle and check your knock count while driving at different speeds.
as far as knock goes, i have had up to 5 counts with the tuned ecu
with the untuned ecu i have up to 3, but could probably get it to 5 if i tried hard enough
as far as the fuel trims go, i will have to get a log of my car idling and have someone look at it
on the logs i do have the fuel trim values are within their 5% as they are supposed to be, but i will get that up for someone to look at
right now it is on the untuned ecu, i am going to drive it and see how the spark plugs come out, so far they are normal(so far) so it is possible that it was just the tune, but it just seems odd that it worked really well for a couple of days
I honestly have no idea what your infatuation with looking at spark plugs is.
The BEST way to tell how a car is running is to log it. Knock sums, Wideband AFR, load and a bunch of other stuff...
You will NOT get a true reading from spark plugs unless you beat the hell out of your car, turn the car off at 7200 rpms and coast into your driveway...
Cheers-
E
____________________________
Warr's personal competitor
