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Old 01-24-2007, 07:40 PM   #16 (permalink)
 
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They mainly work on Evos and STis? You sure about that? I haven't met or seen one Subie/Evo that has mentioned them in person or online. There's not many Evos in our area to begin with, and there's only a few shops known for doing Evos, not all of which are trusted.

Most STis know to go to Super Rupair in Denver or Revolutions Tuning in the Springs.





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Old 01-24-2007, 07:45 PM   #17 (permalink)
 
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Please don't tell me this is the method you used for your car or plan to use. You should always use a logging program or wideband when tuning with a AFC. Listen to Warr and Fourdoor they will take care of you.
I wasn't playing with it I accidentlly went into some menu and when I tried get out, it went haywire. Trust me im not retarded like some of these idiot kids who think they can tune and end up blowing their engine.
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Old 01-24-2007, 07:54 PM   #18 (permalink)
 
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Whenever i go there the lot is full of evos and wrx's.There is a pretty good amount of Evos on the road here in Denver. Ever since my boy left i don't know who to trust. Some people get the impression that im trying to grenade my engine and make it a full race car but thats not what im after. I just want to know that if another Z 06 pulls up next to me, I can shove that V8 up his ass.
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Old 01-24-2007, 09:03 PM   #19 (permalink)
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I though I know something! But I dont :-(
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Old 03-07-2007, 02:21 PM   #20 (permalink)
 
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I know this is somehwat of an old thread....but I just wanted to throw my opinion in there.

Darwin8 - For the most part Warrtalon know what he is talking about. He is right when he tells you that it's good to get a flash. Although it is not for everyone......A flash did not work well on my black Evo. I had Vishnu and Dyno Flash both do my ECU. Most Evo's take well to Flashes....but not all of them do. Flashes scare me now because of that.

But on the other side of that....My white evo has 360hp corrected on MAC's dyno...and it is only tuned by SAFC II. So my car runs just fine and smoothly with cams and injectors and no flash........BUT......it doens't mean that it couldn't run better...because SAFC only controls fuel...so it will be smoother with SAFC and you might gain some whp....but a flash or custom tune will do you better over all...cause it provides fuel timing, etc. So just go with what you want.....and I know many people who have a flash AND SAFC.....and it works just fine.

As far as cams go...up here either 264's i/e or 264/272 works just fine. 272 is meant for more top end power. If you plan on running a bigger turbo...for 1/4 mile purposes and what not...then you will want 272/272. but if you are sticking with stock turbo...and are doing auto-x and what not...then 264/264..or 264/ 272 works just fine.
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Old 03-07-2007, 03:19 PM   #21 (permalink)
 
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Kevin, in your case, it's not likely that it was the flash that wasn't working - it was more likely that it was a mechanical problem on the car. I have never seen or heard of a car that simply did not take well to a flash. It's always a problem with the car itself, so you should not be afraid of flashes. I, too, have used a flash + SAFC back when we couldn't flash ourselves, but it's no longer necessary. Having multiple flashes for different situations (e.g. street & race) is the best method. Especially so now that we have a local flash tuner who charges very low prices.

And you're right about the white Evo. The SAFC has always been able to make comparable PEAK power as a flash, but it in no way can keep the low-end and mid-range at optimum levels due to not having control of timing. Plus, you don't get _any_ of the features of a flash like launch control, raising the rev limiter, injector scaling, idle control, etc etc.





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Old 03-07-2007, 06:23 PM   #22 (permalink)
 
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Kevin, in your case, it's not likely that it was the flash that wasn't working - it was more likely that it was a mechanical problem on the car. I have never seen or heard of a car that simply did not take well to a flash. It's always a problem with the car itself, so you should not be afraid of flashes. I, too, have used a flash + SAFC back when we couldn't flash ourselves, but it's no longer necessary. Having multiple flashes for different situations (e.g. street & race) is the best method. Especially so now that we have a local flash tuner who charges very low prices.

And you're right about the white Evo. The SAFC has always been able to make comparable PEAK power as a flash, but it in no way can keep the low-end and mid-range at optimum levels due to not having control of timing. Plus, you don't get _any_ of the features of a flash like launch control, raising the rev limiter, injector scaling, idle control, etc etc.
I agree100%. I should have just got rid of the flash and kept it stock. I am sure it was something that was done along the way during my modifications......but thank the lord we have the white one.

I am trying to slowly get the wife to let me get a flash on the white....but she too is scared just cause she saw the problems on the black one....and she attributes it mostly to the flash

I want to make a file of the stock ECU the way it is right now.....so that way if we do decide to flash it....and if it doesn't work....then we can go right back to where we were originally....cause if her car can make 360whp on 24psi with just a SAFCII tune...I bet she could make some great numbers with a flash.

What do you think?
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Old 03-07-2007, 06:42 PM   #23 (permalink)
 
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Kevin, we can do that anytime. I can download your stock ROM and keep it safe for you, or you can get EcuFlash + Tactrix cable and do it yourself. I keep 5 separate maps for my car: stock, street, drag, autox, circuit. You would always be able to flash back to stock in a matter of seconds if you needed to, but I'm certain if you get flashed, it will not cause a problem.

The numbers won't necessarily be higher at the peak using the flash, but the powerband would be smoother and more reliable from beginning to end in each gear. As I mentioned earlier, the SAFC has always been comparable with PEAK numbers, but it's the rest of the powerband that suffers when you don't have direct timing control.





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Old 03-07-2007, 07:37 PM   #24 (permalink)
 
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I agree100%. I should have just got rid of the flash and kept it stock. I am sure it was something that was done along the way during my modifications......but thank the lord we have the white one.

I am trying to slowly get the wife to let me get a flash on the white....but she too is scared just cause she saw the problems on the black one....and she attributes it mostly to the flash

I want to make a file of the stock ECU the way it is right now.....so that way if we do decide to flash it....and if it doesn't work....then we can go right back to where we were originally....cause if her car can make 360whp on 24psi with just a SAFCII tune...I bet she could make some great numbers with a flash.

What do you think?
Smokey, what kind of problems did you have once you had the flash done because the last thing I want to do is screw something up. I'm pretty sure if or when i get flashed i'm going to get rid of the safc because i don't do any tuning myself (cause i don't know how) so what the point of having it.

On the subject of which cams however, I'm not sure which combo to go with because i keep hearing different opinions. I'm told the 264/272 isn't going to give me the power gain i'm looking for. Then i hear the 272/272's will give me a good increase but I may also inherate an unstable idle and problems with emissions. I'm ready to buy but I just don't know which ones i want.
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Old 03-07-2007, 08:08 PM   #25 (permalink)
 
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Darwin's, who is telling you this stuff? You HAVE to tell me where you're hearing this stuff, because you're not hearing it from us.

1) 264/272 will make plenty of power - as much as any normal cam combo
2) 272s will not give you an unstable idle or problems with emissions. That's what the flash is for...

The problem is that no matter what people experience in the rest of the country, we experience things MUCH DIFFERENTLY here at 6000' altitude. 272s are a GREAT combo at or near sea level, but they are not always as effective up here.





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Old 03-07-2007, 08:21 PM   #26 (permalink)
 
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Darwin's, who is telling you this stuff? You HAVE to tell me where you're hearing this stuff, because you're not hearing it from us.

1) 264/272 will make plenty of power - as much as any normal cam combo
2) 272s will not give you an unstable idle or problems with emissions. That's what the flash is for...

The problem is that no matter what people experience in the rest of the country, we experience things MUCH DIFFERENTLY here at 6000' altitude. 272s are a GREAT combo at or near sea level, but they are not always as effective up here.
So are you saying the 272/272 combo would have zero advantages at our altitude?

Why is the 264/272 a better choice?

I hear these rumors and such from a few places. Some are friends who own or have owned DSMs. Others like magazines, internet etc. But you see this is why I became a member here because i need input from others who actually own Evos.
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Old 03-07-2007, 08:31 PM   #27 (permalink)
 
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Well, don't even pay any attention to those sources if they aren't valid. I don't even know where this stuff would come from that you listed previously.

Anyway, I did not say the 264/272 was a better choice, and I did not say 272s would have zero advantages. I am relatively new here to this area, so 95% of my knowledge is based off normal, sea level operation. If we were back in VA, I'd tell you to get 272s and knock yourself out. However, up here, our stock turbo runs out of breath so quickly that we can't even make use of high rpms. So, when you get cams that make most of their power at higher rpms, that is counterproductive when the turbo is hardly making any power up there. Plus, the cams increase airflow, which makes the boost taper even worse due to volumetric efficiency.

I have a set of 272i/264e that would have been great at sea level, but for whatever reason, I made _0_ gains in whp/wtq up here. I had the same exact power curve after cams even with a retune, and I lost 200rpm of spool. That is not normal and is very hard to believe, but that's what the dyno said when I did before/after pulls. Maybe that was because I already run max boost on alky and had no room for increased airflow at this altitude on the stock turbo...no one really knows...but I don't expect that to happen to you or anyone else. What I do expect is that you won't gain the normal 30whp/30wtq up here like everyone near sea level.

Anyway, so unless you plan to upgrade the turbo to something that is more efficient at higher rpms or you plan to move closer to sea level, then a set of 264s or a hybrid 264/272 would be the best choice.





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Old 03-07-2007, 08:51 PM   #28 (permalink)
 
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Well I'm not planning on blowing the brains out of my engine in fact the cams and flash may be some of my last upgrades. Maybe an exhaust manifold or some other simple bolt ons later but that's about it. I'll take you advice on the hybrid combo. Should I go 272i/264e or vice versa.
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Old 03-08-2007, 12:18 AM   #29 (permalink)
 
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I'm running HKS 264/272's and dyno'd at mac around 350+awhp/tq catless on 91 octane. I've just got the basic boltons. MAC autosports told me that 264/264's give the best results up here at elevation, from their experiences. My recommendation would first be 264/264 and then 264/272.
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Old 03-08-2007, 12:21 AM   #30 (permalink)
 
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Oh, I'm currently running the SAFCII. Will be switching to the ECUFLASH soon though.
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